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Going Hunting? Or are you just out to kill! - - - 144 messages. Showing 51 through 60. Go to page: 1  2  3  4  5  6   7  8  9  10  11  12  13  14  15 
mallard1662
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Daily Subscription Msg 51 Posted: 07:38 AM 09/21/07 (CST)
GREAT reply web dude!!


Mallard smile smiley smile smiley smile smiley



SurfsUp
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Daily Subscription Msg 52 Posted: 08:50 AM 09/21/07 (CST)
John and Backwoodsboy15 both raise a valid point.

Backwoodsboy15 states, "Did you know? That hunters are conservationist, not JUST by keeping animals at a reasonable population, also that all the hunting and fishing products hunters and fishers bie, 3% of that money goes to conservations! WOWWWWWWWW!!!!!!! (yes I did BWB15)

Johns article stated, " Everyone benefits from the excise taxes that hunters voluntarily pay on guns, ammunition and outdoor equipment". and also, "These dollars have been used to purchase millions of acres of public lands". as well as , "Hunters and fishermen fund nearly 75% of the annual income for all 50 state conservation agencies. Through license fees and excise taxes on arms and gear, sportsmen contribute $200 million per year for wildlife conservation. (U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service)

I agree with these statements. They are self evident facts.

John and Backwoodsboy15,
You bring an important idea out that I think we would agree upon. The inflow of dollars from taxes levied on outdoor gear (guns, shells, etc.) has been a major componet in wildlife land retention and wildlife species reintroduction. I am in agreement that those dollars are critical...I just think it is not being handled properly or fairly. Please allow me to explain before you shut me out, close your mind, and start formulating a defense..just honestly hear this part out....

Those are tax dollars from sporting goods that largely fund these endeavors. That is a self evident fact. No disagreement from me.

Habitat destuction means the need to purchase lands to keep habitat secure.. that means lots of cash. Reintroduction and expansion of species ranges means lots of cash as well. My thought is this...if hunting/trapping were banned it would result in a massive shortfall of tax dollars as this is largely funded by the relatively small number of participants. I feel the same amount of revenue should and could be brought in through the general tax system. In effect everyones personal income taxes would rise some to make the monies available..but those of you who hunt would actually see a REDUCTION to your total taxes paid per year as there would be no taxes on the outdoor gear as the needs were now spread out to all citizens. This would encourage many more folks to take an interest in preserving, restoring, and learning about the things they are funding. Nature observation, birding, hiking, fishing, mountain biking, canoeing and kayaking, etc. would see a massive boom. The tax dollars should actually INCREASE allowing for the retention of larger land purchases and habitat chunks for nature reserves that all folks could access and enjoy. It is a win/win...less taxes for those most actively involved in using the outdoors, a larger chunk of overall available funds to pay for habitat purchases, restoration, and species reintroductions... unless you feel the compulsion to kill. I agree with the monetary need...there is just a much better way to do it... if folks will release the need in their hearts to kill in order to prove something to themselves or others.

If you are honest I think you can see that the monies to pay for these things are readily available from other sources than the purchasing of items that enable the hunt and kill.

The financial funding of projects argument is the strongest one the hunting community has in my opinion. However, if my prescription above were followed there would be more money for those projects at a lower overall tax rate for those actually using the outdoors. In light of that this line of thought seems to fall short on the hunting side. In all honesy...since the monies can come from elsewhere then there is no reason to continue that reason as a justification for yourself except to sooth a conscience is there?

Please..some of you who deeply hold to hunting rights explain why habitats should not be funded this way...unless it really is a need to kill that drives a guy and not these reasons that are being used as a cover for the truth.
BACKWOODSBOY15
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Daily Subscription Msg 53 Posted: 02:28 PM 09/21/07 (CST)
As a hunter, I do enjoy the kill, but not in a sick way. Most times the deer will win the battle of smelling me or seeing me before I make the shot. Dont forget sound, most animals have an accute since of sound. So the animal does have defences, and alot of the time he wins! When I do make a kill on an animal, I focus and make a quick clean shot, I don't like the fact if the animal has to suffer. And if you dont make a not so good shot on an animal, try to the best of your ability to recover that animal, if so try not to let the animal go to waste! Here's a valid point however: If you can not find the animal you shot and give up, odds are that a coyote or any other predetor will find the animal and that animal will feed on it, so either way your contributing to the woods...
gunflint
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Daily Subscription Msg 54 Posted: 05:39 AM 09/22/07 (CST)
Surfs up,

You seem to misunderstand my reply. I gave no reasoned response to your question because you are not worth talking to. Your responses remind me of a child throwing a tantrum. I do apologize to the gay community though. I thought moveon.org was a left wing political organization financed by Soros. In fact they have been on the news lately for their "betray us" ad. I didn't realize it was a gay site. By the way, I haven't hunted in years. I never claimed to speak for anyone, just myself. I can see what your up to and will waste no more time on you.






The secret to fishing is to catch the biggest fish and to catch it early.
Stick 'Em
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Daily Subscription Msg 55 Posted: 07:52 PM 09/23/07 (CST)
Surf's Up,

Sir, with all do respect. I appreciate your questions and opinions. I am an avid tournament fisherman and full time guide. I am a bass fisherman, a 100% catch and release bass fisherman. Every once in a great while I do keep a couple cold water crappies for a good old Minnesota fish fry. I have lived in Florida and a good old shore lunch is something (to me) not to be taken for granted. My father is a gigantic hunter. He lives in the mountains of Colorado and spends most of his free time hunting for buffalo, elk, mule deer, and others. To me it is not that pleasurable. I have joined him when I was a teenager, but never really picked it up. Fishing is my thing. When people are hunting (killing as you put it), I am out fishing.

I am really not into killing animals either. Although not because I have a particular problem with it I just would rather not. I just never really got into it. Although I can see how people could. Now you seem to be a very smart guy. Your answers, questions, and facts are all very well stated and educated. You call people out when they answer or stat ignorance. However I must say that you as well have a ignorance about you. Actually more of a "my S&%T don't stink attitude". I find it totally acceptable that you have these opinions. But why can't you accept that people have legitimate interests that you do not. Don't tell people that they just enjoy the kill and not the relaxing walk through the woods. I mean come on. It's better than sitting in the office. That is like saying it is not worth it to go fishing if you did not catch anything. I make my living fishing, with a grave importance on "catching". Yet a day on the water without a nibble is still enjoyable for me, maybe as well as humbling, but none the less enjoyable. I deer hunted with my Dad for years and never was upset if I didn't get a deer, the time with my Dad, in the woods is what it is all about. I'm sure there are some people that are totally unsatisfied if they don't get their "kill". But not everyone.

You are a very passionate person. I appreciate a good debate. I think what you say is reasonable even if I don't agree with you. I think maybe you should try to think that way sometimes. It's ok for you and I not to share the same point of view. It would be scary if we all did.

Again SU. I share interests with you and I disagree with you to. I will eat the heck out of some chicken. TO ME CHICKEN IS DELICIOUS! Again just my opinion. You may think that mushrooms are delicious. I hate them. But maybe I like to take pretty pictures of them. You won't hear me yell at you for picking them and eating them. You are entitled to do just that.

Far out? Maybe. I catch fish for their pictures. A good majority of these fisherman eat them. I won't be belittling them for it.

I know you are just speaking your mind and your beliefs but keep in mind. Although you are very educated in your debate. At times you come off demeaning. I'm sure you don't on purpose (or maybe you do), but please keep in mind everyone is entitled to an opinion.


Happy Fishing, hunting and surfing!

Stick 'Em


www.joshdouglasfishing.com
SurfsUp
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Daily Subscription Msg 56 Posted: 08:05 AM 09/24/07 (CST)
I must admit to being a bit astonished. I asked a very specific question in MESSAGE 52 about the funding dollars gleaned from sporting and hunting use taxes. I also gave a viably alternative way to get those dollars. THE REASON FOR ASKING THAT QUESTION IN MESSAGE 52 IS THAT THE HUNTING COMMUNITY SAYS THIS IS ONE OF, IF NOT THE, MOST IMPORTANT REASONS HUNTING SHOULD BE ALLOWED.

I ask again, is there ANYONE in the hunting community that has a well thought or reasoned reply as to why the funding proposals for habitat retention and species reintroduction should not be changed away from hunting use fees and taxes to my ideas expressed there?

If there is no one in the hunting community at all that can give us some rational thought on that I suppose we will consider the point conceeded to the animal right position. This astounds me because it is the single strongest..and potentially ONLY valid point the hunting side of the issue has. And yet NOT ONE person has been able to voice a reason to continue it.

If in fact it is not a valid reason then perhaps we are getting closer to really seeing WHY folks hunt.. if not for the benefit to wildlife.

Please, reread message 52. I again say ....Please..some of you who deeply hold to hunting rights explain why habitat purchases and species reintroductions and stockings should not be funded this way...unless it really is a need to kill that drives a guy to hunt and not these reasons that are being used as a cover for the truth.

If no one in the hunting community can give voice to any well thought out and common sense reasons...then any unbiased observer must consider the point conceeded to the animal rights side.

STICKEM-- thank you for expressing yourself in a reasonable and respectful manner. If all in the hunting community would do the same we could have some real debate based on ideas and facts rather than just name calling and rhetoric. I do not come to the same conclusions as you..but it appears that you are a person who could actually have an adult discussion on a topic and perhaps even have an open enough mind to change it on occasion. A rare quality these days...glad to see you were raised in a way that let you have some of that rare quality!

BACKWOODSBOY15--Your last post was much better in terms of the maturity level shown-IMHO. You express your feelings well in your second post. However, you also did not address the point and question I made in message 52. If your future input is as well expressed as your last message I would enjoy hearing your response to the ideas in Message 52. I hope you take time to consider and respond to them. Appreciate your attitude and tone though in you last post. Thanks for showing a mature example for others.

GUNFLINT--If you can see what I am up to then you can see I am attempting to engage in respectful, healthy debate. You have done nothing but name call and make hateful statements. Then when you look bad you say, "I am not talking anymore..or "I can see what your up to and will waste no more time on you." So.. you will take your ball and go home when you feel like you are losing the game. I hope you reconsider that and engage the debate as a mature adult with an open mind. But, that choice is up to you. We will see which road you choose.

Get The Board..SurfsUp
Bobber Down
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Daily Subscription Msg 57 Posted: 09:12 AM 09/24/07 (CST)
I know last weekend was the MN Grouse opener, I was just wondering if anyone went out for it, where and how you did? I won't be able to make it out until next weekend, but I can't wait. I just thought maybe I should remind you all why I started this thread!! ooo smiley




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mallard1662
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Daily Subscription Msg 58 Posted: 10:16 AM 09/24/07 (CST)
hey BD i was again up in your neck of the woods....we saw some grouse but the leaves are a bit thick as of now....no shots were fired.
But we still had a good time imagine that!!



Bobber Down
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Daily Subscription Msg 59 Posted: 10:41 AM 09/24/07 (CST)
Mallard,
Sounds good, thanks for the report!



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WebDude
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Daily Subscription Msg 60 Posted: 11:05 AM 09/24/07 (CST)
Hey BACKWOODSBOY15,

Welcome to My Fishing Pals. Glad to have you aboard!



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Going Hunting? Or are you just out to kill! - - - 144 messages. Showing 51 through 60. Go to page: 1  2  3  4  5  6   7  8  9  10  11  12  13  14  15 
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